Science Projects Volume II:The Work & Life of Philip Harold Otto.

ART VOLUME ONE PRESENTS:

A Conversation with Philip Harold Otto.

AV: You were born, in a Mill town north of Seattle in Everett, Washington.

What was it like being raised there & what are your childhood memories?

PO: Brick Victorians in the mist.

Highways, cut through vast evergreen forests – occasional glimpses of rocky peaks.

Learning to read from road signs while in the back seat of my mother’s station wagon on long drives.

Visiting Tom Robbins Place in La Connor.

The construction of the Pilchuck Glass Studios out in the woods.

My brother’s older friends talking about Purple Bracket Fungus on tree trunks, during walks in the woods.

Only I knew it wasn’t Purple – they were just on acid, that’s all. . .

Staring up at the night sky through the top of an abandoned cinder cone, in a field of brick rubble that was once a paper factory – slightly stoned.

Wearing nothing but forties clothing and jeans from thrift shops.

Cutting my finger off while carving, and having my father sew it back on- in the kitchen.

Hiking from Mt. Rainier to the Canadian border on the Cascade Crest Trail with inadequate gear- because, I was inspired by Dharma Bums. .

AV: These memories are pure poetry- & I see their influence reflected in your diverse work, ruggedness, mystery, curiosity, vivid color schemes, exploration, family & love for the wilderness. And, Kerouac is greatness-.

Pretty amazing- that your father sewed your finger back on!!

Did anyone ever talk about the ‘Wobbly Massacre‘ of Everett- which you told me about?

PO: The Wobbly Massacre for me, was a brass plaque on an old brick building in the tiny downtown section of Everett –.

I cried.

AV: I would have cried as well, what a horror.

Your father was from Rudyard, Montana, and a Thoracic Surgeon, what is his history? And, what was it like to have a surgeon for a father, especially one that specializes in opening up the chest?

PO: Rudyard is a town of about 300 people on a good day.

It is in eastern Montana – the American Siberia.

Lots of Germans moved there thinking that they could own their own land, etc…

That’s us, Prussian peasants and mercenaries that wanted to be free!

My grandfather worked for The Great Northern Railroad, bought land, lost it in the dust bowl, went back to work for the railroad until he blew his brains out.

My father- James, worked hard to get into Columbia Medical school, and beyond – Seattle, was his dream.He also played classical piano –Chopin, a surgeon & great talented hands. . .

AV: No wonder you & your siblings- have such a balanced, reverent, realistic, exploratory view of & connection to nature..& In your work ethic, creativity. And, he was a classical pianist!!

How profound…..

I love Chopin..

I have a grandfather that committed suicide as well.

&, I see great influences in your work, of biology, science & definitely organicism-. Do you think that your father having been a surgeon & a classical pianist- has influenced your work, your process?

PO: I have talked to my sister Cathy about this quite a bit.

The creative process is actually the same as far as we can figure by comparing notes.

You have an idea – you see if you can work it out.

Enter, process.

I work in a multi – disciplinary manner, so, this makes good sense to me.

Take idea – translate it into the appropriate medium. All technique is there only to support this premise.

Something like that. . .

AV: Your work is, very multi- disciplinary, “All technique is there only to support this premise” yes..

And your mother Ruth, was from NYC & she was a nurse.

PO: She was able to get out into the world by being a nurse.

Today she would have become a doctor undoubtedly.

Then it was like – nurse, teacher, something. . .

She was also a very capable and prolific photographer and a very creative person – very much a teacher to her five children.

AV: I’d like to see more of Ruth’s photographs, I love the self portrait of her that she took in the mirror…

PO: There are more, the Mexican building, that whole series- was a collaboration with Ruth.

I am responsible for the damage to the negatives – a flood, happy accident in many ways.

Also the editing, cropping, processing, etc.

That sort of thing.

I have all of her slides – a vast life work from her world travels.

Endless, empty cities and landscapes – she was always up early, to get the shots before people would even show up.

AV: Again, with Ruth’s life & creativity- there must be some scientific & biological influence there, do you think so?

PO: I think art should not be self referential – it has to be about something: life.

Is that biology?

AV: Yes. It is all inclusive.

I’d love to hear the story about your mother & father, their walk from North Africa to Berlin, with Patton, what led them to take this incredible voyage?

PO: My parents walked from North Africa ( Morocco ) to Berlin- because, they were in a MASH unit with General Patton’s army.

My dad was a surgeon and the main health inspector as well – certifying everything from hygiene in the kitchens to the OR procedures.
I heard stories of my mother driving up Vesuvius as it erupted- while they passed through Sicily – she went up until the tires melted!
They were married in Nancy France as they passed through there – I have a sister of that name.
My mother, was in the first group sent into Hitler’s bunker to try to prevent his suicide – she was a tough cookie.

That is why they walked. They had some great stories!

AV: GASP! Incredible-life & love story, would make for a great book or film!! You are the youngest of five- children, now what was that like?

PO: You could watch the ones before you, run various experiments, and wonder about them.

My oldest brother was away at college most of my childhood it seemed.

He was a math prodigy identified by the government to help them get the edge in the space race.

He went to Cal Berkeley early, and traveled for the government a lot before that too.

Not a good childhood for him from my view – my take away: don’t be a genius!

Be regular people!

Anyway, he sent me the Metamorphosis when I was in sixth grade and I loved it – the dream logic of it, but I couldn’t get the point.

Jim explained it – before he was a bug they treated him like a bug.

Once he was a bug, they still treated him like a bug.

That made sense to me.

AV: Ha ha, “You could watch the ones before you, run various experiments, and wonder about them.” Funny…

Kafka’s Metamorphosis really got me feeling oddly pegged sometimes as well, many of us who have read it, of course.

Your oldest brother is a mathematics prodigy, following- is your sister who is a hand surgeon, then a brother who is an artist as well as a skier, & a sister who invented Heart Imaging Ultrasound.

PO: Jim lives in Chicago off in his own world.

Nancy is a hand surgeon in San Antonio.

Louis is the father of Alexandra who is a photographer, Ski Instructor & Model.

You got Cathy right – research MD at U of W, in Seattle.

AV: What is it like being in such a creative & wonderfully holistic family?

PO: It is similar to the Wes Anderson Film, The Royal Tenenbaums – education is all professional class people can give their kids – there is no inheritance.

OK, there is one oil well in eastern Montana – but that makes about $50 per month.

AV: Hah ha ha… That is so funny, the thought had crossed my mind, that you are somehow like the genuine- Royal Tenenbaum Family! I love the film.

The North Cascades in Seattle are absolutely stunning, you all must have had quite a relationship with the North Cascades, especially with all these photos of you all in the Mountains..

Lot’s of photos of amazing mountains, you all- have.

PO: I miss the North Cascades all the time – they are harsh,

unrelenting, and beautiful.

AV: What are some memories of this time in your life?

PO: Louis and Cathy took me everywhere.

They liked to let me drink wine and dance around the fire in my long

underwear like a maniac.

AV: Oh social & familial fires & bonfires must- make a return!

You lived in in Toulouse as a child? Tell us about that..?

PO: My parents helped a family in Toulouse during the war.

The Dubosts are a wonderful family – the father, headmaster at Lycee Haute

Eleves College Pierre Fermat, the mother so elegant, as only the French can

be – a boy, a girl.

I would hike by myself in the Pyrenees.

Later the girl, Anne, came to hike in the Cascades.

Endless meals at friend’s farms and estates. Ah!

AV: And, Beautiful living, breathing, timeless- mountains! Mountains!! Again….

When did you start training in Haida carving with Bill Holm?

PO: About fifth grade – his daughter was my French teacher too!

AV: Wow.

What brought about your interest in the Haida?

PO: Not just Haida – that was far away.

We lived near the Tulalip Reservation and there was a lot of the coast

carving culture around.

You first make your Adze.

Then, you start carving.

The museums in Seattle and Vancouver have great stuff.

You can’t help but be influenced.

My church as a Child, the Presbyterians, burned poles as Pagan Idols.

I had some real childhood anger and bitterness about this!

AV: Oh I would have been absolutely vitriolic.

Absolutely amazing.

I love Totems, all the wood carvings of that whole region- & The Haida artist Bill Reid. The Tlingit-.

I did not know about the Tulalip.

Did you ever learn to speak Haida or Tulalip? “Haw’ aa” is Thank you in Haida.

Tulalip or Lushootseed- is a beautiful language, sounds like song & soft rhythm.

PO: Sadly – no.

AV: Do you still have any carvings that you made from that time & do you

still make carvings?

PO: My brother in Seattle has some, my sister in San Antonio as well –I

don’t keep stuff.

AV: We want to see them Otto………….

( AVI would like to Thank the Otto family, for sending us these images. )

I think that your experiences with the Haida has influenced your current work, you think so?

PO: Absolutely – I work very hands on, and always need a connection to

wood!

AV: &, you use recycled wood in your designs..Recycled wood people!

I can clearly see why you would be drawn to Franz Boas, and- the

Kwakiutl Indians, please tell me about your essay on Franz Boas and the

Kwakiutl.

PO: He was doing that German tradition thing- of just cataloging everything for generations to come, but it lacked his personal insights which are, ultimately, essential.

So much of what he knew and experienced was lost in this way.

Still, bless him, it’s some cool shit!

Stanford at that time did admissions very personally, so I was pleasantly

surprised to have dinner with Dean Hargedon when I arrived in Palo Alto

and found out he knew the essay well!

AV: What were your experiences at Stanford like?

PO: I had very high expectations when I arrived.

I felt very isolated in high school and thought college would be so

wonderful, intellectual, inclusive – but I was still weird there too!

Hah! I’ve adjusted now, I’m OK, yes. . .

Academics were tough but I found that if there was an essay, I could get an A.

By the end of my sophomore year I had really done all the requirements for

graduation and I couldn’t imagine what to take!

So, I went to the San Francisco Art Institute to pursue my artwork more intensively.

I then discovered punk bands, became a singer, bass player, song writer, etc.

Stanford took me back at full credit for my senior year.

AV: What an evolution, now a musician as well! What Punk Bands?

PO: I was in the Seattle music scene that led up to the Grunge years.

I was in the Punk band Raw Meat in the SF scene- circa 78, 79.

Then, the post punk band, Rapid -I, Seattle scene circa 80, 81 & we were mentioned in the book, Loser: The Real Seattle Music Scene, by

Clark Humphrey…

Then- was an experiment in live dub Steddi-5, Seattle

scene circa 82- also mentioned in ‘Loser’.

AV: ‘Bash my Head’ & ‘Slogans’ from Raw Meat, are great!!

&, I never heard of the book, I will look into it, Grunge- come back…..

Then- you pursued studies in Cultural Anthropology and Studio Art &

Painting! What was this period of your life like, what were you discovering

& what questions were you asking?

PO: I went ‘Native’.

Why just study culture when you can mess with it?

Punk bands, my artwork, and finally spaces- were / are my vehicles.

AV: I have an odd philosophy about space, as in what is a real space. You

beat me to it, I just write and think about it, you materialize it.

What are your philosophies of space??

PO: To create a memorable event / experience – there are too many neutral

spaces around.

Create difference. . .

AV: What was the social & cultural climate like through your eyes- in Palo

Alto California at the time?

PO: Palo Alto was nothingness, Stanford is known lovingly as the farm –

that is appropriate. It connects easily by train to San Francisco.

AV: You say about this time-”I spent my junior year at the San Francisco art institute while Chris Burden was locked in a locker there.” Ha ha ha, wow…I like Burden, did you see his ‘Shoot’?

PO: I’m aware of it. Didn’t see it, no.

AV: It seems that you are very open & fascinated with mortality, I am too. Are you?

PO: I’m very aware of mortality.

I have this horrible sense that I will die one day!

Is it true?

Seriously, I do feel that way and worry that I will run out of time to get done

all the things that I would like to do.

I find the time limit very daunting, I guess.

AV: One lifetime is not enough I say, I am in agreement.

Quite a way to warp perception, the death question.

Your ‘Skull’ piece comes to mind in it’s vibrant scratchy cobalt blue, print lacing beneath.

PO: Just a doodle on a page from a book by Burroughs that I’ve kept. . .

I think he talks about the artist Philip Taaffe in Ghosts, maybe. I can’t exactly recall – but the page is not still in the book!

AV: Once you were finished at Stanford you went to Pacific Oaks of Pasadena & got your Master’s in Human Development.

What were some of your experiences at Pacific Oaks?

PO: Pacific Oaks was amazing.

I grew a great deal there.

I had a professor who would pile up her paper work and then see how quickly she could just get through it – like a race.

Point being, it held no interest for her, but admittedly it had to be done!

I thought this was a wonderful and somewhat humorous strategy.

Another professor, I had named Brown, was I believe Native American.

But, in teaching about diversity she one day told me, “Oh no, it’s German, you know- Braun”. . .

It made me think.

I love that she never went back to it or explained it.

How do I feel if she is Native American? How do I feel about her if she is

German?

Both are plausible.

I think this is an especially big deal for Americans – who are we?

Oh, I have a German last name – but, wait, I really am not German at all, or

am I? A very big issue- identity I think.

Does this make sense? I think it’s complicated.

AV: Yes, I agree, we often ask- in every sense-who the hell are we?

Hmmmm, lot’s of answers & plausibilities for that one. The paper race pile- funny, hah, I’ve seen that happen before.

Then you taught in early childhood for five years, can you tell us about

this experience?

PO: In the middle eighties, I taught early education: a pre-school lab with

researchers and parent involvement.

I then, taught kindergarten.

I finally settled for the longest bit – three years, with second grade in a San Francisco prep school.

I love teaching and could happily stay there.

But, I wanted to do more with my artwork which involved a different

level of commitment at the time.

AV: I bet this prepared you quite well for fatherhood yes?

PO: Yes and no.

Kids tell you what they need and you try to listen well.

It lacks the formality of the teaching relationship in the best possible way!

AV: Soon after this experience, you worked at The Exploratorium in San

Francisco, in exhibit design- what was that like?

PO: The Exploratorium is great.

They didn’t allow too much specialization at that time, so, I built walls,

was trained as an electrician, worked with Brian Eno on an early

installation of his aural / visual environments, & I was Ned Kahn’s studio

mate.

That was the beginning period of the idea for my approach to architecture.

AV: You were trained as an electrician?Where did you go to do that? &, Eno

Makes sense- you & Eno….

PO: I was trained at the museum – I wired Eno’s installation myself!

AV: Wow. I love Eno!! Can you tell us more about the installation you worked on with him?

PO: I was the kid that did the set up and ran the electrical – it was great to be

around as he worked – he sings!

AV: HERE COME THE WARM JETS!

What was it like being Ned Kahn’s studio mate?

PO: He was Robert Oppenheimer’s assistant as a very young guy. Ned is

amazing as an artist and a person. His billboard covered in sequins– it

looks like a photo of the wind.

AV: Wow. He’s incredible, the billboard- does look just like a glittering gust of wind..

Nice to see the wind in his work, makes me think of what I see of

the wind on water, in the trees, flags, fields..

I’d like hear more about your experiences- as the Facilities Director and Affiliate Artist- when you were at The Headlands Center For the Arts in Sausalito-, during- the David Ireland, Ann Hamilton, Andres Serrano, Bruce Nauman, years.

What was it like having all these great artists around you, working with

them & how did it influence your work?

PO: I lived at the Headlands, I organized the renovation of abandoned

military buildings. I worked with my hero – David Ireland. What can I

say? This is when I had my first commissions to do commercial spaces.

AV: Then you Started The Otto design group in 1990, what was this like for you & what were your concepts & influences at the time, was sustainability important to you from the start?

PO: It was impossible.

It was fun.

I felt like I could do things. I felt like there are wonderful people in the

world.

I had enough money to buy a used Volkswagen – or I could start a

company!

So what is there- to stop me!

How could I do worse than non profit pay?

I then, proceeded to show how that can be done. . .

AV: I bet it must of been hard at first- !! It’s gut wrenching moments &- of

course moments of great buoyancy.

You have really succeeded in your visions Philip, in your designs, you build

sustainably which is really honorable, you create such accessible &

inspiring varieties of space which allow for so much creative possibility-&

innovation.

These are environments that one can make their mark & mold, become

inspired by, participate- in, consciously.

You also started 222 Gallery- soon after Otto Design Group, what

compelled you to start your own gallery?

PO: The gallery started as a way to support artists we were involving in projects. Os Gemenos was the first show – their first in the US.

Each show has led to the next.

AV: Then you opened another 222 Gallery, soon after- in LA- as well.

PO: Yes, wherever we have an office.

I think design studios are dreadfully boring to look at.

AV: What a fabulous idea! Yes design studios can sometimes really be- a too

dry eye sore, but not yours!!

It seems like you really love Philadelphia, you take some really stunning

portraits of the city, what drew you to Philadelphia?

PO: I have learned to love Philadelphia- the surreal, abandoned elegance, the

Wissahickon Park, the city of R.Crumb’s childhood, Sun Ra, Coltrane, etc..

It’s weird in the way Seattle is weird.

You can buy a building and do weird projects.

See Big Kids, Little Kids by John Freeborn- as well..

Yes, I have learned to love it.

I moved initially because of work.

My wife, Susan, is creative director at Urban Outfitters which is based here.

She needs to be here and my daughter loves the woods – she’s five.

We also live in Venice Beach. My daughter really loves Venice Beach!

AV: Sounds incredible- again it’s art, poetry & influence, exploration..

It is wonderful that you & your wife & family travel so much,

living & working, building in all these incredible places- reminds

me of my upbringing.

You all must love to juggle travel & work, yes?

PO: We all love it. My daughter, Emmy Isabelle, started traveling with us at

19 days old – she is a wonderful traveler, handles it so well.

AV: And Susan is interested in sustainability & the environment as well

yes?

PO: Susan, loves the found object a great deal and has a great sense of

materials – always a wonderful use of reclaimed elements in her work, the

ordinary object elevated. . .

AV: You have designed some environmentally friendly, UO as well.

PO: I’m proud of the one I designed for the Oxford Circus location in London.

I’ve also done, Far Coast with the planted roof….

Real Goods, the water sculpture there, Marshall Mc Gearty – is all

reclaimed, UO- Costa Mesa – freeway debris

sculpture, etc…

& I designed the gates to the Solar Living Center in Hopland, CA, and the retail interior as well.
The gates embody wind, solar, hydro in a metaphorical way.

The water sculpture piece is my favorite – it is so simple.

A pipe leaks water onto corrugated metal panels.

As it falls it creates the sound of rain on a tin roof.

Quite lovely, especially on a hot day in the wine country.

And, UO is a great client and makes the commitment to the use of a great deal of reclaimed material – especially flooring.

The exterior sculpture we created for UO in Costa Mesa & listed

above, is a huge arcing wave, made completely from the local debris of freeway construction sites.
With any client, the focus has got to be on the culture of the audience that needs to be reached.

However, salvaged materials, architectural details, found furniture, etc, can all be used for character yes, but also make good economic and ecological sense at this point.

Energy efficient lighting is a good example of green agenda thinking that checks as a good move, even in the most cynical business analysis, because it saves money.

The work with Odg is intrinsically Green.

John Schaeffer, who started Real Goods the solar company, once

told me I was green without even saying it based on early

dumpster diving approaches to projects he had seen by our group.

That was why he brought us into the Solar living Center project where we were part of an all star green team that included Sim Van der Ryn, Ralph Nader, Greenpeace . . . Odg!
Marshall McGearty I should tell you is in the Wicker Park area of Chicago.

It has my favorite reclaimed floor thus far – railroad ties from South East

Asia – all Teak and other tropical hardwoods.

Next to Moroccan tiles, & salvaged church pews. . .

But, it is a smoking lounge / club backed by RJ Reynolds!

I could rationalize that it takes smokers out of the public space, that it has a prototypical air system that creates better air quality than is found on the street outside the doors, which is true.

But mainly it is the hedonistic side of tobacco – a gourmet offering where you can design your own blend and have a Latte while you wait.

Some like Heroin, some like Tobacco.

Still, not PC. . .

We did get Coca Cola to go Green that same year though!

AV: They are great spaces & works, even more so- for their creativity &

environmental thoughtfulness.. And, you are innovative & creative in the way

you visualize, describe & manifest- spaces, which translates quite well, in your

work. I love the Water Sculpture.. The SLC wow!

I will certainly make a visit to Marshall McGearty in Wicker Park.

Yes we all pick our poisons.

My Grandmother Lilly who worked in Interior Design & my uncle Lars who created & ran ASKI, I am certain- would be unduly impressed.

& fantastic- that you got Coca Cola to go Green!!

Speaking of poetry, who are your favorite poets?

PO: The word poetry has always worried me.

Beethoven wrote little, but notated some great things when he did.

I like what he said about his music- “I am a tone poet”.

I like the idea of something like ‘word sketches’ as a phrase

better by the same token.

Poetry seems so loaded with expectation!

Anyways, I like Brautigan, Rilke, Schiller, Poe. . .

AV: I love Rilke-.

‘A Peculiar Ideal.’

By, Friedrich von Schiller -

“What thou thinkest, belongs to all; what thou feelest, is thine only.

Wouldst thou make him thine own, feel thou the God whom thou thinkest!”

Great poets & related themes- to yours, as well.

Here is one of your poems:

An Unknown Form.

At one time

the military

had built concrete bunkers

on three hilltops

to observe the horizon

cautiously

I found these outposts

years later

abandoned

I put

radio wave disruptors

in

each bunker

a government agency

in researching

the source

of the disturbances

found a shape

a ragged triangle

in which

no transmissions

of any kind

could be heard

that void

will be

my sculpture

AV: You are a partner in the software firm Verificon, with Princeton

researchers – & hold the patent for retail flow and response observation

software?

What is retail flow and response observation software?

PO: I have Stanford friends who asked me to be a consultant in generating

applications for their software design.

Wayne Wolf was my good friend in college.

I now have a patent of software that links cameras to computers and analyzes how people really move through spaces.

There really are no metrics for this currently – so how are spaces planned?

It’s a bit of intuition and superstition right now.

AV: Sounds really, really interesting, I want to put one of these in my house, for flow, analyze my movements… HAH!

PO: Visual recognition software takes video and translates it into metrics so you can begin to measure movement through a space – bottlenecks, dead spots, high traffic, what really happens and what really works objectively.

AV: What would one hope to see, or read as the outcome? More efficient use of space?

PO: You could look at space- like hits on a website – a page at a glance that shows you areas of greatest activity, neglect, etc. .

Basically what are the areas of focus and interest – not just what you suspect, but a pure view of it. Like science – you can see the objective results of your plan.

AV: Some of your ‘Sketches’ are reminiscent of Kathe Kollwitz, do you like her?

PO: I love Kathe Kollwitz, yes – also Lovis Corinth.

AV: Corinth, greatness.When did you teach at The University of the Arts in Philadelphia?

What was this like for you?

PO: At U Arts I taught professional practice with one of my former design

associates of Otto Design Group – Rama Chorpash, and lectured on the use

of reclaimed and green materials in Otto Design Group projects.

And, at Princeton I lectured on the analysis of contemporary consumer

culture.

At Philadelphia U. I lectured on our approach to design at Otto Design

Group.

AV: Do you have any cinematic influences?

Some of your spaces call out for dreams, books, letters, music, a sense of & time & place..Drama! & peace-, like stages, for these events to occur.

PO: Chris Marker, Tarkovsky, Kurosawa, Kubrick. . .

Robert Frank, he did some experimental films involving insect

wings. . .

I’m a fan – I have many heroes!

AV: I am just discovering, Marker & Tarkovsky- Thank you- they are

great!!! I see- the influence….

Why is sustainability, energy efficiency & the environment

important to you in your design work?

PO: I would say that ultimately we do culturally based design at Odg.
Everything, every discipline, every team we assemble for a project is acting in support of this premise – that we will start with the client’s audience and speak appropriately to that group.
Having said this, basing decision making in culture- sustainability, energy efficiency, the environment- flow inescapably, from that premise.
You could say it differently – real materials with character, cost conscious, memorable.

What audience doesn’t want these things.

Then you can bring green agenda practices without trying to convince – it just is.It’s in the approach.

It is what is attractive- in the work.

It’s there whether you talk about it or not – intrinsically!

AV: I really believe this is true, very well said-

“You could say it differently – real materials with character, cost conscious, memorable.What audience doesn’t want these things.”

As an artist & a designer, what is it about the spaces that we live, work & create in, that you think is the most important to focus on?

PO: That spaces and environments should be interesting and inspirational.

When you leave them you want to tell someone about the things

you saw, what you were able to do.

This can mean many things from a space that is so simple that it is the perfect blank page to an environment that is so intense you want to visit it, leave, and return again and again.

AV: Where else to go, but in & out of rooms, spaces & places, where else to live, it’s culture-a culture of spaces & worlds…

What incredible places to go, Odg’s thoughtful, unique & inspiring creations.

Thank you so much for carving up such a great Totem with us Philip.

Philip Harold Otto’s work & many more spectacular designs are at ODG

& visit- 222 Gallery.

Interview of Philip Harold Otto, for ART VOLUME ONE,

by, Chicago artist & writer, Amy M Denes.